23.11.2006, 19:29
Keller: When did the Diamond Studd come up in that run, then?
Hall: Ric Flair was booking. He booked me with Terry Funk twice on TV. The first time I was out with Terry Funk's daughter all night. I didn't do nothing' with her, but I was out all night with her, treating her with a lady. Nothing like that. But the next night that f---er hit me with a branding iron so hard, I got like eight stitches. So blah blah blah, time goes by. I get to next TV, they got me booked with Terry Funk again. I went to Flair - plus I had already called Otto Wanz, this wrestling company in Europe and Austria. I said (to Flair), "Look, I've already put the ***** over on TV once. I'm not doing it again." Flair said, "Nobody's asking you to do it." I said, "Ric, f-- you, man. You're the one calling the shots, you're writing the TVs. Don't f---in' tell me you didn't write this down. I'm not doing it. And by the way, I'm giving my two weeks notice. F--- you!" So I went and worked for Otto then. Then I was kind of unemployed and I came back from working with Otto. But I left on kind of good terms, you know what I mean? I did jobs on the way out. But not on TV. And then I called (Dallas) Page and now I'm coming back with my wife six months pregnant from Europe. I was just going to go work at Sears. I figured I thought I had it, but I guess I don't, so f--- it. I called Page and told him to get me a job. And so that's when the Diamond Studd was born. It could have been way better, but they had me in that jobrini spot.
Keller: It was a weird era for WCW because it seemed like they were trying to find what their niche was. They were no longer the We Wrestle promotion.
Hall: Wade, you know what my only comment has been about it when people ask me about these things? I always make this distinction. WCW is a television program that programs wrestling and the WWE is a wrestling company that programs wrestling. Know what I mean? Turner, they put wrestling on their station, but Vince (McMahon) is a wrestling company that produces and programs wrestling shows. That's the distinction. It's not hard to tell the distinction when you watch the show. I mean, it's like watching good porn and bad porn. Vince's show is way tighter, way better, although it's deteriorating in my opinion. I've always said this, too. You're only as good as your opponent. DX is red hot right now. I want to say kudos to the whole defacing the property and the spray paint. Wow, how original! It's kudos. They're my boys. They're paying me and Kev tributes by copying our sh--. How can DX be DX, just two of them? How long can that last? I just think right now they're the hottest thing in wrestling, without question. Shawn Michaels is one of the most gifted, talented wrestlers and athletes in the world. Hunter is, Paul, whatever you want to call him, is also equally talented. He's super. Between the two of them, they get it. They know how to make money, they know how to do business. But guess what, Wade? Who are they going to work with?
Keller: The McMahons and that's it.
Hall: Gee, wow, that draws money. How many times can you put them (against each other). Now it's Hell in a Cell! Oh gee, a lot of people are going to buy that.
Keller: I think a lot of fans look at DX and they like them from a nostalgia standpoint. They're not the same as the original.
Hall: They need Road Dogg, they need Billy Gunn, they need the whole crew.
Keller: And (Sean) Waltman, more than anybody. I think fans see this as just a short term reunion tour of the band. I don't think they see it as something long-term. I think that does limit them.
Hall: That's why it's withering. Okay, let me ask you this? This may be too soon, because you may want to end (the interview) after this. I ain't tired of talkin' This gets me psyched. What's their main music? What happens if you hear, "Are you ready?" So what happens if they play that and then the arena goes dark, and then you put that (sings music) f--in' NWO porn music? What's gonna happen?
Keller: What would happen if that happened? I don't know.
Hall: Well, would the people just sit there and twiddle their thumbs?
Keller: They would pop because they would anticipate something about to happen that's pretty newsworthy.
Hall: Then put us on the TitanTron. On the Tron. I don't know.
Keller: I want to tie a bow around that first run in WCW. You talked about how it felt like a conglomerate that happened to be running a wrestling show. You hadn't advanced to the WWF yet, but was there anything you took from that experience at that time that you either learned what to do right or what to do wrong given the way the company was run.
Hall: You want to hear a funny story?
Keller: Yeah, of course.
Hall: My good buddy Curt Hennig was working for Vince right? I used to call there once a month. I'd call Pat Patterson's office. I get his secretary. "Can I speak to Pat? Can I speak to Pat?" "He's busy right now." "Well, tell him Scott Hall called." The first time I debuted on Vince's TV, I come in for a tryout, them *****es make me drive from Orlando. So after a sh-- box drive from Orlando, I can't afford no hotel. So I drive right back home. And I got three messages on my phone. So I called Pat. All of a sudden I get right through, boy. Funny as heel. "Hey, Scott, how you doing!" (imitating Pat). That's when I went to the black and the stubble and I changed my look. Pat says, "God damn, Vince loves your look. He loves it. Tell me, did you sign a contract with those guys?" I said, "Pat, I just signed a one year deal with those pricks." I said, "I don't wanna work there. I wouldn't have called your office if I had wanted to work there." You know what he said? He goes, "Don't worry, in a year you'll be able to tell them New York wants you." So, I just put in my time and tried to get over as good as I could.
Keller: So you knew for the last year you were in WCW that you were going to head to (the WWF)?
Hall: Yeah, but Vince still makes you earn it. He makes you earn it. I mean, a year went by. He makes you earn it. You see, I earned it.
Keller: What's the best part of that run in WCW? Was it getting to know Dallas Page?
Hall: Don't get me wrong, I loved Dally and he did a lot of things to help me, but have you ever met Dallas Page?
Keller: Yes.
Hall: He is exhausting.
Keller: (laughs) That's a good word.
Hall: And I'm not. You know what I mean? But Dally is a wonderful person and I wish him nothing but the best, but he was like holy roller.
Keller: It doesn't slow down, it doesn't stop. It's 98 percent him.
Hall: He's a total self-promotion guy. He's always on, you know?
Keller: He doesn't seem to realize it, though?
Hall: You know what? Dallas is an overachiever, man. And you know one thing I will say in all pride is that anybody ever treated me good in this business, I always paid them back. Like, one night in New Orleans in the Super Dome when the NWO was red smokin' hot and it was me, Kev, Hogan, and we might have had Giant. We're growin'. So we called Dallas out. We were offering him a t-shirt. So he takes the t-shirt, puts it on. Kev goes to the corner and stands in the corner and raises his hands in the corner. I pick Dallas's arm and raise it up. Dallas spins me into the Diamond Cutter, bang, peels the t-shirt off, throw it on me, Kev charges him, boom, sidestep Kev, backdrop him over the top rope. F--in' people going crazy. Dallas runs up the crowd in the SuperDome. That was the first time he ever did that and it became his gimmick. He rode up in the SuperDome and it made me feel good because I was paying my boy back, you know. And it made him. He was the first guy to say no to the NWO. It was pretty sweet. But you know how we always talked about it, you gotta have opponents. That's why I was talking about DX before. DX is great and the Outsiders are great. You know, how far can they milk that sh-- with the McMahons? They're gonna need opponents.
Keller: When you did go to the WWF, was it a matter of money at all, or was it total faith that that was the place to be where the most opportunity would be and that's where you wanted to be?
Hall: It was a dream come true, bro. I'll never forget going into a meeting. Vince goes, "Well, I understand..." Because Vince back then, business was different. Everybody was a Bossman or a Firefighter or a Convict. Why can't you just be a wrestler, right? And luckily I had Hennig with me. So we went into Vince's office. He goes, "Well, I understand your father's in the army." See, I knew I was going to meet with Vince, and I had been around six, seven years, so I wasn't that nervous. At this point I figured I had nothing to lose. What are you going to do, send me home? F--- you, man. I'll bounce in a bar. I don't care. Like, when you don't care, you have power. There's two times in this life, in my opinion, you have power. When you have enough power you don't give an F. And when you have so little money, you don't give an F.
At that point, I said, "Vince, you want me to be a G.I. Joe, I'll be the best G.I. Joe I can be. Did you ever see Scarface?" He went, "Wella, uh, no, I didn't." I went, "Say hello to the bad guy." I just started to doing all that schtick with him. And having never seen the movie, Vince thinks I'm a genius. (laughs) Know what I mean? "You need somebody like me, man, so you can point your stinkin' finger and whisper, Look, there goes the bad guy. You're never going to see another bad guy like me." He's looking at me markin' out. He's never seen the movie. He doesn't know I'm doing Tony Montana. He thinks I'm making this sh-- up. He said, "We need a name." I said, "Well, how about Razor?" I had been thinking about it. I had tossed around a few names. I liked Razor. At that time there was Razor Ruddick, the boxer. I went, "I'd kick his monkey-f---in' ass." And Vince started laughing and went, "Fine, fine. We need a last name." So I ran out there and I was taking a p*ss, and Tito (Santana) was washing his hands. I said, "Tito, I need a last name that starts with an R, man." He went, "Ramon." I went right next to him and said, "Razor Ramon." He said, "That's it." And that was the birth of Razor Ramon.
Wade Keller: At the meeting with Vince (McMahon where you proposed the Razor Ramon gimmick), did you sense there was any apprehension about letting you create your own gimmick?
Scott Hall: But he owned it.
Keller: So it didn't matter then who came up with it. He was cool with that.
Hall: I created it, but he copyrighted it. See, you gotta understand about Vince at that time, had I already licensed Razor Ramon, he wouldn't have used it. He was pretty brutal. I was one of the first guys to ask Vince for more royalties. He told me no. Before I left Vince to WCW, I said, "Can I work in Japan?" Let me have four weeks a year in Japan. I wanna work for you; let me work in Japan. I said, "Vince, I know there is only so much box office money, only so much pay–per–view money, so let me work in Japan. I still wanna work for you. Let me work there. It's their money. It's not yours. You see, back then it was a private company. So if you made more money, Vince made less—and that's the way he looked at it. It was coming out of his pocket. So then he went, "No." I said, "Well, sh––, Vince, I ain't no mathematician, but what about like if you move that point over a little bit on the royalties, the Hall family would really benefit. Would the Vince McMahon even notice the difference?" He went, "Well, no. Maybe in the future, but I'll give you the same thing I give Taker and Shawn (Michaels) and Diesel" and blah blah blah. I went in with two offers and he turned me down.
Hall: Ric Flair was booking. He booked me with Terry Funk twice on TV. The first time I was out with Terry Funk's daughter all night. I didn't do nothing' with her, but I was out all night with her, treating her with a lady. Nothing like that. But the next night that f---er hit me with a branding iron so hard, I got like eight stitches. So blah blah blah, time goes by. I get to next TV, they got me booked with Terry Funk again. I went to Flair - plus I had already called Otto Wanz, this wrestling company in Europe and Austria. I said (to Flair), "Look, I've already put the ***** over on TV once. I'm not doing it again." Flair said, "Nobody's asking you to do it." I said, "Ric, f-- you, man. You're the one calling the shots, you're writing the TVs. Don't f---in' tell me you didn't write this down. I'm not doing it. And by the way, I'm giving my two weeks notice. F--- you!" So I went and worked for Otto then. Then I was kind of unemployed and I came back from working with Otto. But I left on kind of good terms, you know what I mean? I did jobs on the way out. But not on TV. And then I called (Dallas) Page and now I'm coming back with my wife six months pregnant from Europe. I was just going to go work at Sears. I figured I thought I had it, but I guess I don't, so f--- it. I called Page and told him to get me a job. And so that's when the Diamond Studd was born. It could have been way better, but they had me in that jobrini spot.
Keller: It was a weird era for WCW because it seemed like they were trying to find what their niche was. They were no longer the We Wrestle promotion.
Hall: Wade, you know what my only comment has been about it when people ask me about these things? I always make this distinction. WCW is a television program that programs wrestling and the WWE is a wrestling company that programs wrestling. Know what I mean? Turner, they put wrestling on their station, but Vince (McMahon) is a wrestling company that produces and programs wrestling shows. That's the distinction. It's not hard to tell the distinction when you watch the show. I mean, it's like watching good porn and bad porn. Vince's show is way tighter, way better, although it's deteriorating in my opinion. I've always said this, too. You're only as good as your opponent. DX is red hot right now. I want to say kudos to the whole defacing the property and the spray paint. Wow, how original! It's kudos. They're my boys. They're paying me and Kev tributes by copying our sh--. How can DX be DX, just two of them? How long can that last? I just think right now they're the hottest thing in wrestling, without question. Shawn Michaels is one of the most gifted, talented wrestlers and athletes in the world. Hunter is, Paul, whatever you want to call him, is also equally talented. He's super. Between the two of them, they get it. They know how to make money, they know how to do business. But guess what, Wade? Who are they going to work with?
Keller: The McMahons and that's it.
Hall: Gee, wow, that draws money. How many times can you put them (against each other). Now it's Hell in a Cell! Oh gee, a lot of people are going to buy that.
Keller: I think a lot of fans look at DX and they like them from a nostalgia standpoint. They're not the same as the original.
Hall: They need Road Dogg, they need Billy Gunn, they need the whole crew.
Keller: And (Sean) Waltman, more than anybody. I think fans see this as just a short term reunion tour of the band. I don't think they see it as something long-term. I think that does limit them.
Hall: That's why it's withering. Okay, let me ask you this? This may be too soon, because you may want to end (the interview) after this. I ain't tired of talkin' This gets me psyched. What's their main music? What happens if you hear, "Are you ready?" So what happens if they play that and then the arena goes dark, and then you put that (sings music) f--in' NWO porn music? What's gonna happen?
Keller: What would happen if that happened? I don't know.
Hall: Well, would the people just sit there and twiddle their thumbs?
Keller: They would pop because they would anticipate something about to happen that's pretty newsworthy.
Hall: Then put us on the TitanTron. On the Tron. I don't know.
Keller: I want to tie a bow around that first run in WCW. You talked about how it felt like a conglomerate that happened to be running a wrestling show. You hadn't advanced to the WWF yet, but was there anything you took from that experience at that time that you either learned what to do right or what to do wrong given the way the company was run.
Hall: You want to hear a funny story?
Keller: Yeah, of course.
Hall: My good buddy Curt Hennig was working for Vince right? I used to call there once a month. I'd call Pat Patterson's office. I get his secretary. "Can I speak to Pat? Can I speak to Pat?" "He's busy right now." "Well, tell him Scott Hall called." The first time I debuted on Vince's TV, I come in for a tryout, them *****es make me drive from Orlando. So after a sh-- box drive from Orlando, I can't afford no hotel. So I drive right back home. And I got three messages on my phone. So I called Pat. All of a sudden I get right through, boy. Funny as heel. "Hey, Scott, how you doing!" (imitating Pat). That's when I went to the black and the stubble and I changed my look. Pat says, "God damn, Vince loves your look. He loves it. Tell me, did you sign a contract with those guys?" I said, "Pat, I just signed a one year deal with those pricks." I said, "I don't wanna work there. I wouldn't have called your office if I had wanted to work there." You know what he said? He goes, "Don't worry, in a year you'll be able to tell them New York wants you." So, I just put in my time and tried to get over as good as I could.
Keller: So you knew for the last year you were in WCW that you were going to head to (the WWF)?
Hall: Yeah, but Vince still makes you earn it. He makes you earn it. I mean, a year went by. He makes you earn it. You see, I earned it.
Keller: What's the best part of that run in WCW? Was it getting to know Dallas Page?
Hall: Don't get me wrong, I loved Dally and he did a lot of things to help me, but have you ever met Dallas Page?
Keller: Yes.
Hall: He is exhausting.
Keller: (laughs) That's a good word.
Hall: And I'm not. You know what I mean? But Dally is a wonderful person and I wish him nothing but the best, but he was like holy roller.
Keller: It doesn't slow down, it doesn't stop. It's 98 percent him.
Hall: He's a total self-promotion guy. He's always on, you know?
Keller: He doesn't seem to realize it, though?
Hall: You know what? Dallas is an overachiever, man. And you know one thing I will say in all pride is that anybody ever treated me good in this business, I always paid them back. Like, one night in New Orleans in the Super Dome when the NWO was red smokin' hot and it was me, Kev, Hogan, and we might have had Giant. We're growin'. So we called Dallas out. We were offering him a t-shirt. So he takes the t-shirt, puts it on. Kev goes to the corner and stands in the corner and raises his hands in the corner. I pick Dallas's arm and raise it up. Dallas spins me into the Diamond Cutter, bang, peels the t-shirt off, throw it on me, Kev charges him, boom, sidestep Kev, backdrop him over the top rope. F--in' people going crazy. Dallas runs up the crowd in the SuperDome. That was the first time he ever did that and it became his gimmick. He rode up in the SuperDome and it made me feel good because I was paying my boy back, you know. And it made him. He was the first guy to say no to the NWO. It was pretty sweet. But you know how we always talked about it, you gotta have opponents. That's why I was talking about DX before. DX is great and the Outsiders are great. You know, how far can they milk that sh-- with the McMahons? They're gonna need opponents.
Keller: When you did go to the WWF, was it a matter of money at all, or was it total faith that that was the place to be where the most opportunity would be and that's where you wanted to be?
Hall: It was a dream come true, bro. I'll never forget going into a meeting. Vince goes, "Well, I understand..." Because Vince back then, business was different. Everybody was a Bossman or a Firefighter or a Convict. Why can't you just be a wrestler, right? And luckily I had Hennig with me. So we went into Vince's office. He goes, "Well, I understand your father's in the army." See, I knew I was going to meet with Vince, and I had been around six, seven years, so I wasn't that nervous. At this point I figured I had nothing to lose. What are you going to do, send me home? F--- you, man. I'll bounce in a bar. I don't care. Like, when you don't care, you have power. There's two times in this life, in my opinion, you have power. When you have enough power you don't give an F. And when you have so little money, you don't give an F.
At that point, I said, "Vince, you want me to be a G.I. Joe, I'll be the best G.I. Joe I can be. Did you ever see Scarface?" He went, "Wella, uh, no, I didn't." I went, "Say hello to the bad guy." I just started to doing all that schtick with him. And having never seen the movie, Vince thinks I'm a genius. (laughs) Know what I mean? "You need somebody like me, man, so you can point your stinkin' finger and whisper, Look, there goes the bad guy. You're never going to see another bad guy like me." He's looking at me markin' out. He's never seen the movie. He doesn't know I'm doing Tony Montana. He thinks I'm making this sh-- up. He said, "We need a name." I said, "Well, how about Razor?" I had been thinking about it. I had tossed around a few names. I liked Razor. At that time there was Razor Ruddick, the boxer. I went, "I'd kick his monkey-f---in' ass." And Vince started laughing and went, "Fine, fine. We need a last name." So I ran out there and I was taking a p*ss, and Tito (Santana) was washing his hands. I said, "Tito, I need a last name that starts with an R, man." He went, "Ramon." I went right next to him and said, "Razor Ramon." He said, "That's it." And that was the birth of Razor Ramon.
Wade Keller: At the meeting with Vince (McMahon where you proposed the Razor Ramon gimmick), did you sense there was any apprehension about letting you create your own gimmick?
Scott Hall: But he owned it.
Keller: So it didn't matter then who came up with it. He was cool with that.
Hall: I created it, but he copyrighted it. See, you gotta understand about Vince at that time, had I already licensed Razor Ramon, he wouldn't have used it. He was pretty brutal. I was one of the first guys to ask Vince for more royalties. He told me no. Before I left Vince to WCW, I said, "Can I work in Japan?" Let me have four weeks a year in Japan. I wanna work for you; let me work in Japan. I said, "Vince, I know there is only so much box office money, only so much pay–per–view money, so let me work in Japan. I still wanna work for you. Let me work there. It's their money. It's not yours. You see, back then it was a private company. So if you made more money, Vince made less—and that's the way he looked at it. It was coming out of his pocket. So then he went, "No." I said, "Well, sh––, Vince, I ain't no mathematician, but what about like if you move that point over a little bit on the royalties, the Hall family would really benefit. Would the Vince McMahon even notice the difference?" He went, "Well, no. Maybe in the future, but I'll give you the same thing I give Taker and Shawn (Michaels) and Diesel" and blah blah blah. I went in with two offers and he turned me down.